The Things You Find Out Later.

Back during the takeover of General Motors by the feral government, we were told the government had NO interest in “running the company”.

Seems as if that may not be entirely true. Words from a man I’ve had occasion to speak with a few times, always impressed me as a straight shooter. You read, and decide.

From via Drudge.


Feds Told GM To Drop Pontiac Or No Bailout, Ex-GM Exec Says.

From this, to……

… this, and this…..


…to CLOSED. Great plan, eh?




When General Motors shut down Pontiac, it left a lot of enthusiasts wondering why. It was primed with a lineup of powerful, rear-wheel drive models, and seemed like it had a bright future ahead of it. It turns out that GM killed it on government orders, according to former GM Vice Chairman Bob Lutz.

Friend of Jalopnik and west coast editor for Autoweek Blake Rong had an interview with Lutz today, and from what Rong is putting out on his Twitter feed, it’s full of plenty of bombshells. None bigger, though, than this one:  Blake Z. Rong          @bzrong

@brendan_mcaleer @seniagetep Lutz: “Feds said, ‘we’re giving you 60 billion dollars. Drop Pontiac or you won’t get the cash.'”

If true, it’s a big revelation of the scope of power that the government held over GM during the worst days of the recession. Power and threats like that are often spoken of, though rarely in such explicit terms. Even still, there’s not much of an explanation yet as to the specific objections the Feds had about Pontiac. The division seemed to be heading in the right direction after years of wayward stumbling. The Pontiac G8 was receiving rave reviews, and a new GTO was in the pipeline.

Lutz went on to tell Rong that Pontiac was intended to have an all rear-wheel-drive lineup, and that the new Pontiac G6 was supposed to share a platform with the fairly excellent Cadillac ATS.P

It’s amazing what could have been, and we may never know the exact internal discussions the government had when it decided to shutdown the storied brand. Something tells me Lutz knows more of the story.P

UPDATE: It turns out Bob Lutz was speaking at an event at the Petersen Museum in Los Angeles, and expanded on his comments more in a Q&A. Lutz is asked about Pontiac around the 2:14:10 mark here:

Pasted below is a transcript of his words. I’ve bolded the most important parts:

The Feds basically wanted to get GM down to Cadillac and Chevrolet. They said, “you don’t need all these brands. You need one prestige brand, and one mass-market brand.” And we said “well we can’t get rid of Buick because Buick is important in China, and if Buick becomes an orphan in the United States then the Chinese are no longer gonna be interested in it.” And the Feds said “Fair enough, but everything else goes.” We said well we’d also like to keep GMC. They said “well, GMC is basically just like Chevrolet,” and we said “that may be true, there may be a lot of shared components, but GMC has an entirely different image, a different customer base, and people are willing to pay different prices for a GMC, and here’s the profitability,” and the Feds said “whoops, okay, keep GMC.”

So now we had Buick, GMC, Cadillac, and Chevrolet, and then, I wanted, badly wanted, to keep Pontiac, because Pontiac was on its way back, and it had been mismanaged for a number of years, you know, with ‘rebuild excitement,’ and the excitement was only in the plastic body cladding, mechanically there was nothing about Pontiac in the 90s that would make your heart beat faster. And with the solstice and solstice coupe, and with the Pontiac G8, which was a great car. We were embarked on a strategy of making Pontiac different from the rest of GM in that Pontiac wouldn’t get any front wheel drive cars, they would all be rear-wheel drive, and the next G6, was going to use the architecture of the Cadillac ATS, it was going to be a 3-series sized rear-wheel Pontiac, with basically the Cadillac ATS ‘de-premiumized,’ obviously, a lot of the cost taken out, but still fundamentally that architecture.

That was going to be the next G6, and I think we could’ve moved Pontiac away from every other American volume brand and really started positioning it as attractive US alternative to some of the, and obviously at much lower prices than the European rear-wheel drive cars, but the Feds said “yeah, let’s just, how much money have you made on Pontiac in the last 10 years?” and the answer was “nothing.” So, it goes. And, when the guy who is handing you the check for 53 billion dollars says I don’t want Pontiac, drop Pontiac or you don’t get the money, it doesn’t take you very long to make up your mind.

But I think it is a shame, Pontiac was on its way back, and it was killed before it, before the plant could really sprout blossoms, you know, it was well on its way. So, I agree with you, I think Pontiac was a great, wonderful history, mismanaged for a number of years in the 80s and 90s and it was clearly on its way back, and we were starting to see a very good customer base in solstices and especially in the G8, which was favorably compared in a lot of road tests to the BMW 5-series, people would say dynamically the car is as good and it’s more powerful and way cheaper, but that was too bad. but you can’t go through Chapter 11 without some really harmful effects.


Bob, I think the ONLY mistake you guys made was in running to the federal government in the first damn place. You KNEW when Bush was gone, that this administration was going to attach a whole damn ball of strings to this money.

If you did NOT know this, then shame on you, and everyone else at GM for NOT doing your homework on who Obama was, and what he was all about. Besides, Bob, we ALL know WHY GM was bailed out in the first place.

It had ZERO to do with whether you could continue to build Pontiacs, Chevrolets, Cadillacs, or anything else for that matter. Instead, this bailout had EVERYTHING to do with making sure the damnable UAW/ VEBA program remained solvent.

Had GM years ago shitcanned the UAW, they most likely would not have NEEDED to be bailed out.

The taxpayers are STILL in the hole some $ 35,000,000,000 due to this scam. Monies that will NEVER be repaid. Along with the former shareholders, as well as bond, and senior debtholders, along with the MASSIVE amount of creditors who got NOTHING from this sham of a “bankruptcy”.

As for the federal government, here is what the Liar-in Chief said:   “We have no interest in running GM; we have no intention of running GM” at the SAME TIME they were firing the then CEO Rick Waggoner, and installing  Brian Deese, a man who had ZERO experience in ANY private sector company, let alone an auto firm. As window dressing, he then picks Dan Akerson, another Obama supporter, who had previous management experience at AT&T. Hardly an automotive company. Not to mention turning 100 YEARS of bankruptcy law upside down. THAT move alone should have sent a BIG red flag up to the business community as to who and what this asshole was all about.

I’ll sum this up with my thoughts on Pontiac. A decent car, but had been SAVAGED by poor corporate planning, along with bland design and build quality for a number of years. While I believe a good business case COULD have been made to keep Pontiac, when you hop in bed with communistic governments, you WILL catch their fleas. Especially if you let them “help” you.

Think about that, GM, the NEXT time you come to the government hat-in-hand. My hope is that a SANE government will be in place, and let you fade away.

Anyone here know of any lamenting over the loss of such marques as  Pierce Arrow, Packard, Hudson, Studebaker ?  Me neither.



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13 Responses to The Things You Find Out Later.

  1. Buck says:

    The liberal mindset of big business. They haven’t figured out yet that when you go to a loanshark to keep your business open the loanshark will most likely end up running your business to his own ends. doesn’t matter if the loanshark is in DC or the nearest beer joint..

  2. Kathy says:

    GM was the prostitute and obama the paying customer choosing what he wanted ‘performed’. Only problem is he paid with our money, not his own, and we didn’t even get a kiss.

  3. bullright says:

    So the truth oozes out. For guys that seem to love cuts, this administration never saw a union cut they could support. Bastids. At least if Lutz says it, you can believe it went down that way.

  4. Mrs AL says:

    What a pile of whoa. I appreciate you posting this Clyde. You wrote, “My hope is that a SANE government will be in place, and let you fade away.” I agree.

  5. Garnet92 says:

    It’s been PAINFULLY clear, since Ofugyou has been in charge, that having experience in an endeavor is vastly overrated. When it comes to his appointments (much like in his election) all we see are “experienced need not apply” signs. How much evidence does the public need to see to recognize that not only is Ofugyou not qualified for his job, but those that he appoints are not qualified for those jobs either.

  6. myfoxmystere says:

    Too bad GM didn’t learn their lesson when Oldsmobile went under years ago. The same buffoons took over Pontiac, and ran it into the ground, then begged “0fugyou” for a bailout. Too bad GM got some slack when they originally were told to dump Buick & GMC as well. It would have gotten 0bama a big whooping that not many would have forgiven him for, had he gotten his way, and humiliated GM. On the other hand, GM probably would have been forced to merge with Chrysler, causing GM to badge engineer the Dodge Ram trucks into an extremely ugly Dodgeolet or Ramolet.

    As for the loss of Studebaker, Packard, Hudson & Nash, James Nance of Packard started the snowballing when he refused to let George Mason lead the proposed 4 company merger to form American Motors. While George Mason worked a deal which merged Nash & Hudson into AMC, James Nance merged Packard with Studebaker to form Studebaker-Packard, then tripped over his ego, hoping he could strangle George Romney financially to take over AMC as head honcho, making S-P the head company. Instead, he got a mismanaged Studebaker to sink Packard into debt, an angry AMC design engineer to hire an engine designer with the blueprints from a scrapped V8 engine project from Kaiser Willys to build AMC’s 327 V8, and a bunch of Packardbakers rolling off the assembly line from Studebaker’s South Bend Indiana auto plant.

    Had the Big Bosses at GM Studied Studebaker Packard’s blunders, they could have saved Pontiac without bailouts, and even return the Oldsmobile back to the market.